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for benefit of a person like me who lost a bit of touch of Formula 1, can someone who has some time on his hands try to give us a summary of how the things look this season or maybe provide us with a link of this sort, favourites? teams? drivers? tyres?


  • I'm a bit in the same boat.
    Pretty sure we're on control rubber now.
  • Red Bull Racing are at risk of either:

    1) Being the dark horse to win the WCC
    2) Being the dark horse for 10th in the WCC

    Depending on your POV.

    They keep talking a good game .... "aggressive development cycle.... we've only scratched the surface with this car.... the first few races wont reflect the car's true pace" but whether they can play a good game remains to be seen.

    The pecking order as I see it at the moment is

    1. Ferrari
    2. McLaren
    3. Renault
    4. BMW
    5. Williams
    6. Red Bull
    7. Honda
    8. Toyota
    9. STR
    10. Aguri
    11. Spyker
  • That's a pretty good summary.

    Kimi pretty well outpaced by Massa but that's not uncommon for Kimi in testing.
  • I think RBR should come down a peg or four P1.
  • what will happen? (only two weeks to go, I'm somehow excited)

    Toyota to pull out of F1 after 2007
    Hamilton to do a Button
    Renault not to win a single race
    Toro Fanculo to be up for sale after 2007
    Kimi not to deliver
    Massa to win a few
    Alonso to win a few
    Button to finally live up to the hype he got back in 2000
    BMW to surprise
    Spyker to move past Aguri
    Red Bull to prove that 1998 and 1999 was due to Mario Illien, not Newey
  • Spyker haven't got a hope in hell of beating Aguri.

    RBR will finish 5th or 6th best over the course of the season roo.

    [Edited on 2-3-07 by MinardiP1]
  • Because of their drivers, right? ;)
  • Nah, It's 'cos they're Dutch.

  • I meant Red Bull. :(
  • I though you meant Spyker.
    Dammit, I've been offline for too long, and now I suck at the internet :(
  • Well if we're placing bets I will happily bet that RBR don't get above eith place in the championship. They're just not prepared for a competitive season and the drivers know it!
  • The develpoment of the RB3 will see it rise above 8th, Petrol.

    I think 6th, but possibly 5th.

    Jello - I certainly think MW & DC will have the measure of their counterparts at Williams, Toyota, and STR if it came down to the cars being equal.
  • I've had enough of those debates from my time at the Atlas forums. No thank you. :)

    Toyota is the only one that I'm iffy on in deciding RBR's fate. They certainly suck ass right now but they've got money to throw at it mid-season.
  • My Dear P1, the RBR 3 is already nearly maxed out on aero. Thats the one thing you can rely on from Newey. The fact is there is already a recognised top 4 consisting of Macca, Toit, Renault and BMW. RBR are ciculating at 1.5 s off their pace. To find that sort of deficit on these present regs would mean finding a 20% increas in downforce without an incremental increase in drag. I'd guess that both Toyo and Honda will find more development in their cars over a season as a result of greater resources. That leaves RBR fighting with Williams for seventh and eigth spots.
  • You haven't read much about the RB3 have you Petrol? Horner has said that the RB3 is a month behind the other teams in it's development, and it's been widely reported they are trying a revised floor and it's Melbourne spec aero in Magny Cours next week.

    Newey also stated at the car's launch that he hadn't even started the process of bolting on the appendages to the car.

    I know you're at pains to see Webber not actually start to win anything and make you a fool, but how about letting some facts get in the way of the tired old rhetoric for once?

    link 1

    link 2

    [Edited on 4-3-07 by MinardiP1]
  • Horner's response sounds like an excuse to cover poor leadership. Look at the times, they never lie. The only way RBR can move forward is if they introduce a new car.You need 15% more downforce to gain 1s advantage. That sort of leap does not come from sticking bits onthe same car!
  • Well, they are testing new aero pieces at Magny Coors Light this week.

    P1, why does Webber's name come up here? Petrol didn't say a single word about him..
  • No, he didn't.

    But interestingly whatever team Webber drives for, Petrol seems to find reason to rubbish that team. Last 2 years, it's been Williams. This year, it's Red Bull.

    Go figure. Maybe i'm reading a little too much into it, but I always wait for Petrol to find something wrong with Webber's team, and he never disappoints. :P

    Red Bull couldn't really be doing more to show they're serious about winning in F1 than hiring Newey.

    [Edited on 4-3-07 by MinardiP1]
  • On the contrary. If I remember correctly last year you predicted that Williams would outpace BMW Sauber. I said based on performance that this was unlikely.
    Back to RBR. Yes they are testing new parts but it looks like they have speeded up their development program in the hope of closing the gap. It must have been a shock to find the car so slow out of the box.
    I can't see Red Bull cracking F1 long term.
  • P1, you realise that Webber has driven for shit teams, right? You can't really argue with Petrol when you consider that he's been right..
  • We'll have to see whether the spin dissipated by Red Bull holds up. They may believe that they will turn around things by mid season. But starting that far off the pace its unlikely. Also bear in mind that there are now 4 leading teams. And come the second part of that season scoring points is more difficult as the top teams have a fully sorted car by then as well. Kudos to you Jello for spotting that Nwewey would not deliver a orld beater.
  • Just going back to my comments regarding last year Williams vs BMW Sauber..... I would actually have been correct if the Williams didn't have such a litany of technical mishaps - the Williams was as fast a car, albeit a much more fragile one. :(

    Yes, with BMW stepping up top 4 is very hard to crack now.
  • Well if I keep repeating myself, I'm bound to be right one of these days. :P

    As far as catching up, I'm not sure. By being further behind they do have more ground to make up but can probably make bigger steps with less effort, whereas Ferrari et al will have to struggle for every hundreth. Their goal for the time being will include Toyota and Honda, though, who have much more money to do it with. Williams may or may not. Aguri may fall behind too.

    It won't be an easier year though, that's certain.
  • The comparison between the STR and RBR performances is interesting. STR seems to have had less issues with reliabilty. From what I know, a Faenza design team of Fabio Savaini, Mirko Pirini and Andrea Torna were involved in the adaptation of the Red Bull Chassis. I wonder with their experience of what worked for Minardi they simply removed concepts they thought were overly complex for the perceived benifit. I suspect that STR are not using a seamless transmission like RBR. After all there's no point in running a trick gearbox that will give a .3s advantage per lap if it breaks down after 20 laps.
  • That's a good point. Minardi became a pretty talented bunch when it came to putting engines into cars that were not designed for them.
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