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It's official

Detuned Cosworth V10's for next season :(

if they're already developing a V8, why not give it too minardi !!!
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Comments

  • Maybe it's a good thing. All the other teams next year will have to start again and with the new testing restrictions this could work in our favour. Also with a detuned engine, you'd hope reliability wouldn't be a problem. Although it is disappointing. This could work for us. I'm sure Stoddard has weighed up the cost and the performance and then just gone with the cheaper option.
  • didn't look at it that way, but you know we this engine will not be updated and looked after as the other teams, also the weight will plkay against us
  • The size and weight will be a problem. But if we were to get the 8 then minardi will have to adapt the PSO5 to fit around it. I think sticking with what we've got isn't a very possitive decision but makes sense. We all knew that PS wasn't going to splash any cash if he could avoid it.
  • From TOMS:
    MINARDI CONFIRMS WITH COSWORTH
    FAENZA, ITALY, May 3, 2005

    The Minardi F1 Team is today very pleased to announce that it has signed an engine supply contract with Cosworth Racing for the 2006 Formula One World Championship season, with an option for 2007. The arrangement will see the Faenza team’s 2006 cars powered by a further development of the famous Northamptonshire company’s TJ 90-degree V10 engine. This follows the team’s initial experience of the TJ2005 power unit in recent tests of its new Minardi Cosworth PS05 at the Mugello circuit and during the San Marino Grand Prix weekend at Imola.

    “Cosworth is delighted to be extending its partnership with Minardi into 2006, as it’s a team with which we have enjoyed a longstanding, and close relationship over the years,” says Cosworth Managing Director, Tim Routsis. “It’s also fair to say there are mutual benefits in such an arrangement. On the one hand, it has always been an integral part of Cosworth’s philosophy to test its products to the limit at the top levels of international motorsport. On the other, it is pleasing for our company, which is now an independent engine manufacturer, to continue to support one of the last true independent teams on the Formula One grid.”

    Minardi Team Principal, Paul Stoddart, comments, “We have been exceptionally impressed with the TJ2005 engine just in the short time we have been running it in the PS05. We can’t praise highly enough the power, driveability and reliability of the new power unit, and we are more than pleased to demonstrate our belief in Cosworth by entering into this contractual arrangement at an early stage of the new season. In terms of engine supply, this is definitely the right way for Minardi to go. The team has enjoyed a strong relationship with Cosworth over the years, and on both a technical and a personal basis, we now look forward to continuing that excellent relationship.”
    I fear about the FIA deciding the rev-limit !!!!!
    Max doesn't like PS, so he might decide to make the limit very low as a means of punishing PS for all the shit he's stirring !!!!
    I hope I'm wrong though !!!!!
  • Imagine if it was like 13000rpm...... :o
  • I don't like this - being with the last independant f1 engine builder means that, with our limited testing time and budgets, that the only dev will come slowly.

    If at all.
  • I hope this season is fun, because if this comes to pass, I think I'm out. 3 years of detuned engines, running Avon tires and 3 year old chassis etc. is a little much to ask to put up with without really anything to shout about.

  • :( Yeah, I'm with you dst. Cosworth probably designed the V8 for nothing, Sauber is going to use BMW engines, Red Bull will use Ferrari V8's. Midland is still a question, probably Toyota or they could go for Ferrari engines aswell, Todt said that it was no problem to supply three teams.

    Anyway, I don't like this at all. He wants to tide over the period until 2008 and then he thinks it will get better but nothing is certain yet.
  • Maybe Stoddart has found a loophole in the rules that will allow Minardi to run the V10 at full power ;)
  • Maybe Stoddart has found a loophole in the rules that will allow Minardi to run the V10 at full power ;)
    Stoddart has found lots of loopholes - Australia this year for example. They never work but he finds them.
  • Sadly, as predicted.

    Where's the bloody ambition?
  • Maybe PS thinks Cosworth might quit F1 if they don't find a buyer for their V8. Then he can ask them a compensation for breaking the contract !!!
  • Welcome to Division 2. Stoddart's (and Cosworth's) accountants are cheering, but nobody else.

    PS can't have weighed up the balance of performance and expenditure, because no one has decided yet what the performance level for V10s will be. One thing is for sure, the manufacturers investing millions against their will in V8s will not be prepared to let a cheapo V10 from a rival look comparable. Therefore the only guarantee is that Minardi have the worst engine on the grid.

    Cosworth will now remain in F1, but unless Frank signs up for the V8s (I can't see that happening, but you never know), they will be there on much the same basis as Stoddart - "let's hang around until 2008, and then we'll see."
  • Imagine if it was like 13000rpm...... :o
    Maybe it's 20000 rpm ;).

    Seriously, it feels crap, because in all likelihood this means next season is set in stone. No escape from the last place, so we have to hope the remainder of 2005 will provide us with some good moments.

    However, is there really another option? Look at Jordan - their car is horribly void of sponsor stickers. Same goes for us too, unfortunately. The OzJet branding just works as a clever disguise, but it doesn't rake in the big dollars.

    Going V8 next season would have meant more expensive engines and probably a costly redesign of the car. If you just throw the V8 into a back of a car designed for a V10, chances are you're likely to have trouble.

    Of course, we SHOULD have the money to redesign the car yearly anyhow. However, sadly we don't and that's just something ones has to live with.
  • The option to go V8, even if unlikely to be financially viable, should have been left open for much longer (up to the point at which serious expenditure would have had to have been laid out on the new car required for a V8). What is going to drive away sponsors and drivers more (tech staff too) than the team officially declaring it has given up on really making any progress up the grid in the next 2 years already?

    Of course, the daft change in engine regs is really to blame, which is really Stoddart's point. Maybe the early declaration is all a part of that sordid little game - particularly given the pointed comments PS made ahead of the announcement.
    Get ready for the arguments over the level of detuning, the accusations of personal vendettas etc.
  • Of course, we SHOULD have the money to redesign the car yearly anyhow. However, sadly we don't and that's just something ones has to live with.
    Which begs the obvious......................WHY BUILD A NEW CAR THIS YEAR!!!!

    It seems with the timing of this it's been the plan all along so what was the point? Any gains made this year are right down the drain when the new engine regs go into effect.

    This is complete bullshit- everyone else is going forward under the exact same conditions. Redesign the car to accept the V8 and get the best price you can from Cosworth, wait til Jordan decides and use the leverage you may gain from being the only probable customer. Or quit.
  • The sad part is that this is the same as accepting last place next year. We can be sure that the rpm-limit will be set so low that everyone that has developed a V8 actually has more power. No engine manufacturer would allow FIA to set the limit so high that an old V10 would outpower a ned V8.

    The two good things (I can think of) are: 1) Minardi saves a lot of money. Cheap engines and no need for a redesign next year. 2) The rew limit will make the V10 produce less power than the new V8's, but maybe not that much less. The FIA has nothing to gain by having Minardi going 3-4 seconds off the pace because they use a V10. I think the rew limit for the V10 will be adjusted to make the power output slightly lower than for the worst V8 engine out there. Minardi will have the worst engines of all the teams, but that's no different than how it is today.
  • I don't think the V10 should make any less power. lugging around 2 extra cylinders is a huge penalty already.
  • Minardi Team Principal, Paul Stoddart, comments, “We have been exceptionally impressed with the TJ2005 engine just in the short time we have been running it in the PS05. We can’t praise highly enough the power, driveability and reliability of the new power unit,
    hoe does he knoew that??

    they have used the engine for one race and both cars did'nt make it halfway through that race.

    sound like a lot of hot air from Stoddart again, always trying to make things sound better than they are.
  • You think the engines failed at Imola?

    It's a press release, get over it.
  • The PR did not say engines did it? It was one tranny cooling issue and another at the tranny/clutch interface.
  • Which begs the obvious......................WHY BUILD A NEW CAR THIS YEAR!!!!
    To prevent us from committing mass suicide due to watching the PS02/03/04/04B one more year.

    No, seriously, that's a good question. I don't know. Perhaps Stoddart is hoping that he can convince the others to be lenient when it comes to restricting the V10. How he plans to manage that remains to be seen.
    Or quit.
    Never. If the alternatives are a Lada Niva or closing the doors, I say paint the Niva black and BRING IT ON BABY!
  • Technical Masterstroke!

    Yes the V10 will be detuned to match the crappier V8s, but while they're screaming their experimental guts out the old cosworth big block will just be lugging along.

    Actually, I suppose this means no new chassis until 2008.
  • A lot of negativity around this thread.

    Really Minardi can't win in here.

    If they didn't build a new car this year we would have gone nuts.

    If we didnt take the V8.....etc....etc.

    Let's see how the rules pan out, who know Mosley might go and V10s stay?? In the end an F1 car with anything less than a V10 is a farce.

    Might as well run them with little 1600cc 4 cylinder engines.....
  • Although the news is somewhat...., well: it's news. At least it's good to see that I didn't crawled through a fence for nothing! ;)

    http://www.telegraaf.nl/telesport/formule1/20498841/Minardi_ook_volgend_jaar_met_Cosworth-motoren.html
  • A self respecting F1 team should at least try to build a new car every year, and at least want to be up there with the big boys. When the team are doing that, and we're still moaning, then call us negative.
  • A self respecting F1 team should at least have control over its own competitiveness! With this one the FIA will have direct and absolute control over Minardi's! :/
  • You hit it Fox. No WAY that engine'll be anywhere near competitive.
  • Its as if we have already given up!
  • It's as if someone else has already given up!
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